Tell us about your foray into the field of field of studying history, writing and lectureship? How did it all begin for you? History has always been my passion. My father, Sardar Abdul Aziz Khan Bangash, has a rather colourful career. He first worked with Allama Inayatullah Mashriqi and the Khaksar Movement, and then became a leader of the Muslim League in the erstwhile North West Frontier Province, even getting shot in the process of one protest. Then, after the creation of Pakistan he joined Kasim Rizvi and the Ittehad-e-Muslimeen and went off to defend the State of Hyderabad. He fought the Indian forces and after the occupation of the Nizam’s Dominions escaped in the jungles of the central provinces before being caught and jailed—and all of this happened before he even turned 20! Listening to his thriller-like life story, I naturally became interested in the context of the events he participated in: who was this Mashriqi person and what movement did he start? Who was he protesting against and why in 1947 Peshawar? And who was this Nazim that he travelled thousands of miles to protect? All these questions made me interested in the study of history and especially in the period around the creation of Pakistan. My interest in history went deeper as I interacted with my father’s friends, who were largely stalwarts of the freedom movement. Growing up in the 1980s and ‘90s there was large-scale disillusionment with what was happening in Pakistan in this group. I still remember an occasion at my father’s friend, Arbab Noor Muhammad Khan’s house, where almost everyone broke down crying at the state of Pakistan. Most of them wondered loudly if they had done the right thing. My mother’s side introduced me to another side of history. My mother is also Pakhtun, but she lived a long time in a house on Temple Road in Lahore which was allotted to her family from Evacuee property. The house was right in front of the Mozang Police Station and a few yards away from the Sikh Gurudwara, which gives the road its name. One of our neighbours was former station house officer Malik Maqsood, who was famous for burning Sikhs alive in the Gurudwara during the riots of 1947. That harrowing tale, which is recounted in Dr Ishtiaq Ahmad’s book in detail, etched itself in my memory and from then onwards it was as if I could not escape the partition. Great history teachers from middle school onwards, with the likes of Nawaz sahib at Salamat and Mrs Rahman at the Lahore College of Arts & Sciences, encouraged and inspired my interest in history so that when it came time for a BA or later a PhD, it was clear that I would focus on an aspect of history. History for me is both a personal, national and international journey. As the great historian EH Carr once noted, history is ‘an unending dialogue between the present and the past’ and hence I have never seen the study of history as something relegated to past events. Our life today is a product of our history, and our future is inextricably tied to how we view and understand our past. History is not all about dates—in fact, I rarely remember exact dates—but it is about ideas, people and life. The study of history is study of our very self, our environment, our city, country, religion etc and without its careful study we are not only incomplete human beings, we destine ourselves to a path of ill informed decisions which only lead to misery and destruction. The lack of emphasis on the study of history in Pakistan was another reason why I chose this subject ‘Education is key even if a person does not wish for a professional job in life. Everything can be improved through education’ What kind of response have your books generated outside of Pakistan? Are you satisfied with it? The response to my book has been very good, both in Pakistan and abroad. I have spoken at several universities and institutions about it and it was formally launched at both the Karachi and Islamabad literature festivals. One important feature of the book was its focus on the question of Baluchistan, and the fate of the state of Kalat, which formed the largest part of the province. I dedicated a full chapter to just know Kalat became a part of Pakistan, which remains the departure point of most Baloch narratives even today. Understanding the root cause of grievances in the province is essential before any approach is made to resolve it. Otherwise all attempts remain piecemeal and perfunctory. Another aspect of the book dealt with the Bahawalpur State which because a full fledged province of Pakistan in 1953. Forced to merge with the One Unit in 1955, it was not restored in 1970 when the One Unit unraveled, but arbitrarily merged in the restored Punjab province. The present movement for a South Punjab province hails back to that period and the call for the restoration of the Bahawalpur province. The book also highlighted a further two arguments: first, it showed in detail the long process through which the state of Pakistan was actually created and consolidated. Hardly anyone had seen the actual map of Pakistan on Independence Day in 1947. Since none of the princely states had acceded to Pakistan by August 15, 1947, western Pakistan was half it present size with no rail connection between Punjab and Sindh, the northern border ending with the limits of Mardan district, and only a notional border with Iran. Nearly a year of negotiations, threats, and cajolement, created the Pakistan we now see. Secondly, the work showed how smaller units worked really well in the initial years of Pakistan. The great strides made by the states of Khairpur and Swat, for example, were a testament to a government which was close to the people and worked for their welfare. Khairpur State was not only the first one in the country to have elections on the basis of universal adult franchise, it had free school education, modern healthcare, a rapidly industrialising economy and all the hallmarks of a developing welfare state—all by just 1955! In the Naya Pakistan, perhaps the model of the really old Pakistan might be dwelled upon. What are you currently working on? Presently I am working on two book projects. I have just completed a history of the Lahore High Court, which has been truly a great experience. I had no intention of writing something on it, but in 2016 the then Chief Justice of the Lahore High Court, Justice Mansoor Ali Shah, asked me to write a small work on the history of the high court as it turned 150 years old. Of course you can’t ask a historian to write anything ‘short,’ and so after more than two years of research in Pakistan, UK, USA and elsewhere, the rewriting of several chapters and the reading of more cases than I would have liked, I hope I have produced something which will add to the very limited literature on jurisprudence in Pakistan. Titled ‘By the Pen or the Sword,’ this book begins in the Sikh era and ends with 2016 when the superior judiciary completed 150 years, charting the development of the idea of the rule of law, the setting up of the formal judicial system and the responses of the people towards it. The gradual decline of the judiciary post-independence, the emergence of judicial politics, and the questionable judgments of the court, all form part of this book, which enables us to understand not only the history of an institution but how the Punjab specifically and Pakistan generally has developed. The second book, which I have been working on for a longer period, is one on the Constituent Assembly of Pakistan. How did the Afkar-e-TazaThinkfest come into being and what drove you to initiate a platform like that? This idea came up because of three critical reasons: first, almost everyone was talking about the importance of academia and how change and development come through it, but no one was providing a means for that change to happen in Pakistan. There were hardly any opportunities for interaction between academia in Pakistan, and almost no avenues for an interface between academia and the public. Most academics feel safe behind their ivory towers which few people can penetrate, and hence the common person is only left with either the word on the street or the jingoistic and sadist television anchors for information and debate. Hence, something had to be done to drag the academics out of their high barbed wire campuses and make them sit and interact with everyday folk for an informed yet accessible and jargon-less dialogue. Secondly, with 65 percent of our population under the age of 30, there were very few avenues for them to indulge in a meaningful and critical dialogue on issues which surround them. Providing a safe, cooperative and engaging space for debate, contemplation and understanding was therefore critical. Of course there are other such festivals too, but what distinguished the ThinkFest was a focus on history, politics, art and science from a largely academic perspective. The other festivals cater to literature really well and so the ThinkFest did not attempt to lobby their space, but created a new avenue for academia and public interaction and discussion. Thirdly, the ThinkFest was initiated to increase interaction of Pakistan with the world. Again, academics like me have access to almost everyone we want to talk to, but to provide the same level of access and interaction to the common person in the country was a great feat the ThinkFest achieved. Bringing acclaimed scholars from Oxford, Cambridge, Columbia, Harvard, Berkeley, Chicago and other places to Lahore, not only opened the minds of the people interacting with them but also the scholars themselves who at times had preconceived notions about Pakistan. The ThinkFest therefore provided a platform for a two-way exchange between Pakistan and the world and exhibited that Pakistan is open for discussion and debate. The absence of a speakers lounge where speakers disappear from the public eye and the creation of a speakers corner where anyone could come and speak, were two initiatives which have distinguished the ThinkFest in Pakistan. Of course the ThinkFest only actually happened because I had great support from the people around me. Foremost, the Vice Chancellor of the Information Technology University where I work, Dr Umar Saif, provided unmatched support. Without his backing, and the help of the Registrar Zaheer Sarwar, the ThinkFest would not have taken off. Even thought this was primarily a liberal arts initative, both of them provided me with their resolute help and support. And then there was Asma Chisty of Destinations Magazine. As the saying goes, she took up the ThinkFest and made it better. Asma’s sharp intellect, wit and almost endless energy took the ThinkFest to another level which I simply could not have done alone. How successful has the Punjab Archives Digitisation Project been in making Punjab’s archives accessible for the general public? The Punjab Archives Digitisation Project has been one of the largest projects I have been associated with. In fact, Dr Saif head hunted me for this precise project. When I began planning for the digitisation of the Punjab Archives I realised how much history the government department had been sitting on! With full records from 1801 onwards, with a few manuscripts dating back to even Mughal Emperor Shah Jahan’s period, the Punjab Archives is a treasure trove for not just the researcher but everyone. Not a day passes when I do not learn something new and unique in the archives. The repository not only holds all original recordspertaining to the Punjab as we know it now, but also Indian Punjab, Haryana and Himachal Pradesh, the erstwhile NWFP until about 1905, Afghanistan, Nepal and even the Persian Gulf. When I was working on the Lahore High Court there, I also found out that the Court had jurisdiction over British subjects in Chinese Sinkiang from 1919 to 1943 too. Hence, CPEC of course has a pre-history! The project ultimately aims to catalogue, digitise and make accessible on an online portal all the record held in the Archives. Of course this is no mean task and will take many years. We are also in the process of linking it to the British Library records so that a person researching in London can also know what is held in Lahore and vice versa. The cleaning, preservation and digitisation of this invaluable record is a long process and we have only just begun, but already we have started seeing an increase in scholarly visits and interaction. Furthermore, we are regularly holding exhibitions relating to the holdings in the archives, with one on the fall of the Mughal Empire opening on August 28, 2018, which will showcase primary documents from the siege of Delhi and the trail of the last Mughal Emperor Bahadur Shah Zafar. You are a highly qualified professional, having studied abroad most of your life. How important a role does education play in strengthening one’s knowledge to implement the kind of initiatives that you did? Education is key even if a person does not wish for a professional job in life. Everything can be improved through education. However, education needs to be internalised, otherwise it only has a cursory effect. If a teacher, for example, herself indulges in littering then there is no point in teaching her students not to do it. In fact, the students will never follow unless the teacher leads by example. Therefore, education is not just the written text, but our environment too. Only a holistic education can change a human being for the better and it is not easy. I have had a privileged life in that I studied the UK educational studies in Pakistan and then got my degrees abroad too. But there is nothing stopping Pakistan from developing such high standards and transforming itself too. The largest percentage of our population is the youth and therefore the time is now for such concerted efforts to be made. I always narrate to my students that I would only be satisfied when just like my undergraduate university, Notre Dame, students take their exams without invigilation on an honour code. The day Pakistani universities achieve that, a truly Naya Pakistan would have emerged. But the task isn’t easy and we must keep striving. You have won many grants, awards and scholarships. What according to you has been your biggest achievement so far? My biggest achievement so far has been to be able to teach students in Pakistan. After my PhD I had several opportunities to stay abroad, and even continue at Oxford, but I left it to come and teach first at Forman Christian College and now at ITU. I made a careful choice not to go to an elite institution in Pakistan because I did not want to teach privileged students, who either already had good teachers or could easily go abroad. Teaching students from literally all parts of Pakistan, from all ethnicities, religions and economic and social backgrounds, at FC College or teaching history to Computer Science and Engineering students at ITU has been the most fulfilling experience. Yes, there are moments of frustration, especially when students do not engage with the subject or just ignore what I am saying, but the sheer fact that at least some students do indeed begin to think for themselves, begin to question and begin to comprehend, is an achievement I believe. What is your vision for Pakistan and what does it mean to be Pakistani for you? Pakistan is my home and therefore it is my responsibly to make it better. After a decade abroad I came back to Pakistan precisely because I did not want to become one of those who complain about the country relentlessly from their abodes in London and New York and yet do not go back and do anything to change things. Yes, I complain about Pakistan a lot, but I am here to make it better too. I think that unless you criticize your country you can’t make it better. If all is well then there is no need for improvement, no chance of development, no yearning for change. Every country has problems, but it is critical that people in that country own up to their mistakes, learn from them and rectify them. Ignoring problems, calling people disloyal or anti-national for pointing them out, and brushing critical issues under the carpet is only a disservice to the country and in fact hemorrhages it. An open, progressive, free Pakistan is what I hope for and am here to help make it happen. Achievements RECOGNISED SCHOLAR Dr Yaqoob Khan Bangash is a historian of Modern South Asia. His current research interests lie in the emergence of Pakistan as a post-colonial state, with broader interests in decolonisation, modern state formation, formation of identities and the emergence of ethnic and identity based conflicts. He has been the assistant professor of DPhil in Modern History at the University of Oxford. PUBLISHED AUTHOR Dr Bangash’s first book was published by Oxford University Press as A Princely Affair: Accession and Integration of Princely States in Pakistan, 1947-55 in 2015 and he has recently completed another book: ‘Between the Sword and the Pen: The History of the Lahore High Court’. CUSTODIAN OF CULTURE In 2016, Dr Bangash founded the first academic literary festival in Pakistan, the ‘Afkar-e-Taza ThinkFest,’ which attracted over 16,000 people in 2018. Since, 2017, Dr Bangash is also the Director of the Punjab Archives Digitisation Project, which aims to make accessible the vast archive in the Punjab spanning over three hundred years. Published in Daily Times, August 22nd 2018.